On this “Face the Nation” broadcast, moderated by Margaret Brennan:
- Reps. Mike Turner, Republican of Ohio, and Jim Himes, Democrat of Connecticut
- House Speaker Emerita Nancy Pelosi, Democrat of California
- Senate Majority Leader John Thune, Republican of South Dakota
- Tom Homan, President-elect Donald Trump’s border czar
Click here to browse full transcripts of “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan.”
MARGARET BRENNAN: I’m Margaret Brennan in Washington.
And this week on Face the Nation: The nation’s capital braces for the unprecedented within the new yr amid rising threats to our nation’s safety.
As Washington prepares to certify the 2024 presidential election, to bid a former farewell to the thirty ninth president, and make approach for the return of the forty fifth, who turns into the forty seventh, to the Oval Office, extraordinary safety preparations are beneath approach, all this because the battle to make sense of the horrifying New Year’s assault in New Orleans and incident in Las Vegas continues.
We will sit down for a bipartisan dialog with the heads of the House Intelligence Committee, Ohio’s Mike Turner and Connecticut’s Jim Himes.
On Capitol Hill, Speaker Mike Johnson’s job is protected for now. And, within the Senate, Republicans take management with a brand new chief, South Dakota’s John Thune. He’s liable for getting president-elect Trump’s bold agenda by way of the Senate.
(Begin VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Will you inform him if you assume he is unsuitable?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE (R-South Dakota): I’ll.
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MARGARET BRENNAN: At the highest of Mr. Trump’s to-do checklist, what he guarantees would be the largest mass deportation in U.S. historical past. We will ask his border czar, Tom Homan, how he plans to execute that.
And, as we mark 4 years for the reason that January 6 assault on the Capitol…
(Begin VT)
RIOTERS: Nancy! Nancy! Nancy!
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MARGARET BRENNAN: … former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi can be right here to speak in regards to the rising threats of political violence.
It’s all simply forward on Face the Nation.
Good morning, and welcome to Face the Nation.
As we start the brand new yr, the primary few days of January are already proving and offering monumental challenges, each right here in Washington and across the nation, particularly by way of safety.
We start at this time with House Intelligence Committee Chairman Mike Turner and Ranking Member Jim Himes, who joins us in a bipartisan trend.
Thank you for doing so and for becoming a member of us at this time.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER (R-Ohio): Thanks for having us.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, we now have, Chairman, heightened safety at U.S. airports, on trains, army bases, this bulletin that went out just lately warning of maybe retaliatory assaults, copycat assaults from that New Orleans car-ramming incident.
How ought to Americans perceive the risk atmosphere we’re in?
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: Right, proper.
Well, it is definitely very troublesome. And our coronary heart breaks as we consider what occurred simply after New Year’s Eve and on New Year’s Day. The – what we all know that the FBI director has mentioned is that we – we’re in a heightened threatened atmosphere.
We see from, in fact, what occurred in New Orleans, we now have the specter of those that may be lone wolves, these people who is perhaps, because the self- declared terrorist has indicated, impressed by ISIS, by terrorist threats. We even have those that – who’re right here who’ve come throughout the border that the director has mentioned are affiliated with terrorist teams or organizations outdoors of the nation who wish to do Americans hurt.
Those people nonetheless pose a risk to Americans and to the United States. The director, the FBI, native regulation enforcement are persevering with to work to attempt to discover them and attempt to reduce the chance, however, definitely, at the moment, as we go into the inauguration for Donald Trump, the place we even have state actors like Iran who – the place we now have in custody people who’ve come right here with the said goal to – to assassinate as part of a plot…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: … to have been alleged to perpetrate a plot to assassinate Donald Trump, we now have plenty of actors that pose a danger and a risk to Americans.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Congressman Himes, ISIS has not claimed duty for this New Orleans attacker. He did pledge allegiance in these social media movies.
But Homeland Security, so far as we now have heard from them, mentioned there isn’t any linkage to the U.S. border. There isn’t any linkage established to a overseas actor at this level. Is this simply an instance of somebody with psychological well being points selecting violence?
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES (D-Connecticut): Well – and I’m glad you mentioned that, as a result of there was a lot misinformation proper out of the field, as a result of these assaults occurred on the similar time. You know, there was all types of stuff on social media about how they had been coordinated and collectively…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Las Vegas.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: … and that the – Las Vegas with New Orleans.
You know, the New Orleans – Jabbar, the attacker there, clearly had himself affiliated with ISIS.
Now, what we have to know and what – up to now, there is no such thing as a proof that that is the case, however we have to know whether or not that particular person was intentionally tasked. Again, no proof that he was. And, in fact, we always see these lone wolf attackers who get radicalized, perhaps on social media, perhaps in another location.
And – and, you understand, I would definitely agree with Mike’s characterization of the hazard on the market, however simply add that, as Americans take into consideration the people who find themselves defending them – and I feel the chairman would agree with me on this – the individuals and property that we put up in opposition to this risk are one of the best on the earth.
It can also be true that lone wolf attackers, that’s, a person who’s not speaking with any individual overseas, who’s not sending texts or sending e- mails, are terribly troublesome to detect. And, you understand, although our individuals are one of the best on the earth, that’s arduous to seek out.
And, by the way in which, there is a function for individuals. You know, in New York City, in case you go on the subway, it says, in case you see one thing, say one thing. And so there is a function for everyone on the market, you understand, to assist attempt to resolve, to assist attempt to cease these sorts of lone wolf assaults.
MARGARET BRENNAN: But, as one official mentioned to me, this is not an issue you resolve with one other plane provider to the Middle East. Some of these items run deeper by way of the lone wolf component. That’s the time period you have used.
How do you diagnose and cope with that, Chair Turner, if individuals are in a position to be radicalized on-line, and whether or not it is political violence or simply one other type of home violent extremism?
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: Well, on the difficulty of New Orleans, we – we do not know but whether or not or not he – he’ll evolve as – because the precise lone wolf, the place he operated utterly alone.
As Jim is saying, because the investigation unfolds, he himself indicated that he joined, as he claimed it, ISIS in the summertime. We do not know what that concerned. We do not know if it should end up that he was tasked. Excuse me. He – he went to New Orleans additionally in October.
There might have been alternatives or occasions at which he may have been discovered and will have been prevented. We’ll study what these are and methods through which he may need been – been discovered, and perhaps we may have intervened.
But these will give U.S. higher alternatives at which we’ll look to how we’d be capable to sooner or later discover others.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Now, we have spoken to each of you on this program, specifically, in regards to the heightened risk atmosphere many occasions. And again in June, when there was that arrest of these eight males from Tajikistan who had been ISIS-linked. We spoke in depth about that.
Chair Turner, shortly after that, you mentioned on this program: “We have terrorists which can be actively working contained in the United States which can be a risk to Americans.”
Do you understand if there are energetic terror cells within the United States proper now?
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: Well, I feel the – the difficulty of cells – and also you and I had been speaking about that initially of the present.
Are there people which can be affiliated with ISIS and terrorist teams and organizations which have crossed the border which can be contained in the United States? Director Wray, FBI director, has mentioned so. We definitely have intelligence that claims so. I agree together with his evaluation. I – Jim has additionally seen it.
He’s testified earlier than our committee publicly of that reality. Those people are working together with – with ISIS, with the intention of harming Americans. The director has mentioned it straight.
MARGARET BRENNAN: They are recognized to U.S. intelligence and regulation enforcement, is what you are…
(CROSSTALK)
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: And we’re working diligently to attempt to take them down, to forestall them from doing so.
And that is why the director is publicly saying such. And that is what the brand new administration goes to be handed, the truth that these people are right here, that we have to find them, we have to take away them, we have to convey them to justice, and stop them from doing hurt to Americans.
MARGARET BRENNAN: When we now have spoken about this problem previously, you characterised significantly the arrest of the eight as a hit story, as a result of there was no plot carried out. They had been disrupted.
Are the people which can be of concern, do we all know the place they’re? In phrases of these eight, they’re – we all know they had been detained, and 5 of them had been really despatched again to Tajikistan.
(CROSSTALK)
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: You by no means know what you do not know. And so none of us definitely in positions of duty would ever say that there is not terrorists within the United States.
Now, I’ll say what I mentioned earlier than, which is that we now have the easiest individuals and the easiest know-how trying to root these individuals out and discover them. But let’s – if the query is, what ought to Americans be afraid of, what has killed Americans since 9/11? It hasn’t been individuals sneaking throughout the border.
And that is to not say that the border should not be safe.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: The border should be safe. But what has been killing Americans? Whether it was Fort Hood in 2009, I feel, whether or not it was the New York assaults that killed eight individuals in 2017, what we simply unhappy – sadly, noticed in New Orleans, it is really Americans who’re on this nation, really, in a weird variety of circumstances, servicepeople.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: That was the Fort Hood assaults. That was what we noticed in New Orleans. That was – although I do not – it does not appear to be shaping up as a terrorist assault, what we noticed in Las Vegas.
So, once more, that is arduous, proper? Why is that tough? Because in case you’re on this nation, you may have constitutional rights, that means the FBI cannot say, and not using a warrant, I would like your Facebook posts, I would like your e-mails. That’s what makes this very arduous.
And, once more, let us take a look at what has really killed Americans within the 20 years. And, sadly, it has been radicalized different Americans. So this will get to the query of, what are the mechanisms by which they’re radicalized, and the way can we as a neighborhood push again on that radicalism?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right, which is why I requested you. That’s a tougher downside to resolve for.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: Much tougher, as a result of you may have constitutional rights and since – you understand, let me offer you an instance.
If any individual is standing out on the road nook proper now saying ISIS is the best factor on the earth, and the president is a traitor, that – individuals would say, boy, we should always interview that particular person. That is constitutionally protected speech.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: And I ponder how a few of my colleagues would reply to the thought, as a result of this particular person in New Orleans did submit some Facebook posts saying, I pledge allegiance to ISIS.
You know, what if we had that debate? Should – ought to Facebook have immediately submitted that to the FBI? And, in that case, the place’s the road?
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: If I say I’m not a giant fan of the following president, and I do not imagine that he was, you understand, no matter, ought to that go to the FBI? It’s a tricky dialog.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: Margaret, there isn’t any query that – that that’s what we’re seeing from New Orleans.
But the reply to your query is, no, we do not know the place they’re. We do not know the place the individuals are that Director Wray has indicated…
MARGARET BRENNAN: The individuals who have exploited vulnerabilities on the southwest border.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: … that has come throughout the border, which can be terrorists affiliated with ISIS, that intend to do American hurt – Americans hurt which can be right here in our nation, we have no idea the place they’re.
And a part of the work and a part of the explanation why he is elevating the alarm is, we have to discover them to guard Americans. Now, what Jim’s saying is totally appropriate. And that – that clearly, is the half that additionally breaks our coronary heart and makes what occurred in New Orleans so arduous is, is that we had an American who was killing Americans.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right, American-born Army vet.
I wish to ask you each about China as properly. In phrases of conventional adversaries, they’re looming giant right here. We discovered simply previously few days that China hacked the U.S. Treasury Department. This is on high of the key cyber espionage in opposition to 9 telecom corporations, in opposition to hacking of U.S. infrastructure that incoming National Security Adviser Mike Waltz mentioned was planting cyber time bombs in U.S. infrastructure.
How a lot of a trump card is that this? I imply, can the U.S. expel China from these techniques and get management?
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: Well, so, I imply, let’s begin with what we all know.
China has been completely predatory in nearly each dimension. They’ve stolen our I.P. – our I.P., our mental property. You know, they’ve manipulated the buying and selling system to hole out our industrial base, completely predatory.
And, by the way in which, I occur to imagine – and it will be attention-grabbing the chair – if the chairman agrees with me on this.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: They imagine they will function inside our networks with out consequence, and that should change instantly.
They want to know that we’re nearly as good at these things as they’re. And in the event that they get into our networks and begin planting beacons or begin planting landmines or no matter, we will do the identical to them, in order that we set up deterrence.
Now, you additionally must acknowledge that China does and the U.S. do about $800 billion in commerce forwards and backwards, proper? And in case you snap your fingers and make that go away, you assume COVID inflation was dangerous? Wait till you see that. By the way in which, they personal a trillion {dollars} of our Treasuries.
So, the purpose I’m making right here is that I feel we should be loads harder on them on the areas through which they’re predatory in opposition to us, whilst we acknowledge that there are areas the place we have to tread very fastidiously, together with that financial interconnection.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I do know that we will have you ever each again to speak about precisely this downside.
I’m out of time at this time, however thanks each.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: There must be penalties.
MARGARET BRENNAN: There – we’ll keep…
REPRESENTATIVE JIM HIMES: What he mentioned.
(LAUGHTER)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We will keep tuned.
Face the Nation can be again in a single minute. Stay with us.
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MARGARET BRENNAN: Tomorrow marks 4 years for the reason that assault on the U.S. Capitol, and we spoke to then-House Speaker Nancy Pelosi simply a short time in the past this morning. She’s recovering from a fall final month.
And we started by asking her why she thinks so many Americans determined that Donald Trump’s help for the rioters in 2020 shouldn’t disqualify him from a second time period as president.
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REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI (D-California): I would not say that the American individuals disregarded this. They simply had a special view as to what was of their curiosity, economically and the remaining.
So I do not – I do not name this a disregard of January 6. I simply name it one thing that they noticed of their curiosity economically.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Even simply final evening at Mar-a-Lago, Donald Trump was screening a documentary in regards to the 2020 election, claiming his win and making an attempt to speak in regards to the authorized challenges he had. There appears to be a continued effort to say that he received in 2020.
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: It’s actually unhappy. It actually is unhappy.
And I do not know in regards to the movie that he had and the remaining, nevertheless it’s – it is virtually sick that he can be pondering that in 2020. He’s received the election now. That can be clear. That can be clear, and, tomorrow, he can be clearly – we can be accepting the outcomes of the Electoral College.
So he ought to be triumphant about that. But to be nonetheless making an attempt to combat a combat that he – he is aware of he misplaced is – is actually unhappy.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You know, the president-elect has mentioned that, within the first 9 minutes of his new time period, he’ll pardon a lot of those that participated in January 6. He mentioned he’ll take a look at it on a case-by-case foundation.
But in wanting again at what occurred 4 years in the past, there are recordings, there’s video proof of what occurred. This is private for you, a few of these rioters in your workplace, chanting your identify.
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Yes. Yes.
MARGARET BRENNAN: One of them, one of many defendants: “We had been on the lookout for Nancy to shoot her within the frigging mind, however we did not discover her.”
For you, that is private. So, if you hear about pardons, do you assume the nonviolent attackers need to be pardoned?
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: The nonviolent – I feel that is a violent attacker, with the intention…
MARGARET BRENNAN: The violence itself.
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Yes.
MARGARET BRENNAN: The violent language, you assume…
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: The violent language, sure, the intention, and, in fact, the intention to assault the vp of the United States.
Now, it did not finish that day. As you understand, he referred to as out to those individuals to proceed their violence, my husband being a sufferer of all of that. And it nonetheless – he nonetheless has accidents from that assault. So it simply goes on and on. It is not one thing that occurs after which it is over.
No, as soon as you might be attacked, you may have penalties that proceed. So I do not – it is actually a wierd one that’s going to be president of the United States who thinks that it is OK to pardon individuals who had been engaged in an assault.
But let’s – you understand, let’s do that. Let’s simply say OK to the American individuals. This is what that is about. Do not be conned by the denial of the election of 2020. And why would he be saying that? But he – however he’s, after which, on high of that, the denial of what occurred on January 6.
MARGARET BRENNAN: But a few of the 1,600 defendants right here had been actually solely charged with trespassing. And if you take a look at the profiles, University of Chicago did a research. About half of those that broke into the Capitol had been white-collar staff. They had been small enterprise homeowners, did not essentially have a felony report.
When you take a look at that profile, you mentioned intention. It – it was the intention itself, you assume, that must be thought-about extra so than the crime, you understand that – that it casts the crime itself of trespassing in a special gentle for you?
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Well, the president mentioned he would go on a case-by-case foundation.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: So I assume that – that a few of these individuals might not have engaged within the violent actions that a few of the others did.
Look, at this stunning Capitol, the dome constructed by Lincoln, beneath Lincoln’s management through the Civil War, they mentioned, do not construct the dome. It takes an excessive amount of metal and particular person energy, manpower, they mentioned, from the conflict effort. And he mentioned, no, I’ve to indicate the resilience of America.
And then beneath that dome, you noticed – you noticed flags, the flags that – you understand, simply horrible flags beneath the dome of Lincoln. And so it was a tragedy, and we can’t be in denial about what it was.
If the president goes to go on a case-by-case foundation, I hope he does, after which perhaps…
MARGARET BRENNAN: Trespassers, you’d be comfy with pardoning?
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Well, simply depends upon how they outline what that’s.
But the – however I do know that a few of that encouragement after which the follow- up that – that so many individuals had been threatened, together with me and – and to my residence, on the lookout for me, and discovering my husband, and, as I say, who nonetheless suffers from head accidents from – on that day.
So, these items do not simply occur and go away when you may have a head damage.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: But, anyway, to – to – to see the risk to so many individuals in elective workplace, now, going past me, however so many individuals in elective workplace, it should not be a risk to your loved ones that you’ve got chosen to do public service.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You wrote in your e-book about that 2022 assault in your husband, and also you mentioned your daughter informed you, if she had recognized what you had been signing up for, she would by no means have given you her blessing to run for workplace within the first place.
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Yes.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Do you assume that this risk of home violent extremism is having a chilling impact on new expertise and – and anybody working for workplace?
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Well, I definitely hope not.
But, over time, after I was encouraging individuals to run for workplace, particularly ladies, they’d say, we may by no means take the abuse that you simply take. And that was actually simply abuse. It wasn’t bodily, it was criticism and the remainder of that, and that we do not need our youngsters subjected to that.
And, sure, I do assume it should have a destructive affect on individuals working for public workplace. Just – you understand, in different phrases, in case you’re – in case you’re a mother, they usually go after you as a – as a mother, and your youngster comes residence crying from college as a result of any individual mentioned a destructive factor as a result of they noticed it on TV, that the opposite aspect mentioned one thing dangerous about you, you may not run for workplace.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So you assume it should discourage significantly ladies…
NANCY PELOSI: Particularly ladies.
MARGARET BRENNAN: … from working?
REPRESENTATIVE NANCY PELOSI: Yes, I do.
I imply, I do know that it has. But I hope that it’ll not, that we’ll have – shine a vivid gentle on this and simply say, that is unacceptable. This is unacceptable. See, for ladies, they all the time – they all the time – ladies are recognized to be extra, let’s say, moral than males. And so, after they go after ladies candidates, they go after their ethics.
And they will say this, that and the opposite factor. And then the kid comes residence from college crying as a result of any individual mentioned a foul factor about mother on TV. And no one – no one desires that. So, hopefully, the brilliant gentle shining on that may scale back – scale back that.
But I feel that girls have a – confirmed that they’re – are extra moral, and that they – they’re – properly, perhaps they don’t seem to be extra moral, they’re all moral, however that they will then face up to that criticism.
(End VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: And you may see extra of our dialog with Speaker Emerita Nancy Pelosi on our Web website and our YouTube web page.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: If you miss an episode of Face the Nation, you may watch it and our prolonged interviews on YouTube or hearken to them on our podcast.
We can be proper again.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: We can be proper again with much more Face the Nation, together with an interview with the brand new majority chief within the Senate, John Thune.
Stay with us.
ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Welcome again to FACE THE NATION.
Republicans have full management of Congress, though their majority is small in each chambers. We sat down Friday with the brand new Senate chief, John Thune, and requested if these slim margins would hamstring the celebration when it got here to creating main coverage adjustments.
(BEGIN VT)
SENATOR JOHN THUNE (R-SD): It’s all the time difficult, and particularly within the – on this present political atmosphere. We do not all the time agree on (ph) Republicans inside the household. But I feel –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Particularly amongst Republicans.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: But why – however I feel in terms of the large points, securing the border, rebuilding the army, strengthening the financial system, you understand, producing power dominance for this nation, these are all issues on which we agree.
With respect to even slim margins, I feel we will have a – hopefully a really unified effort in terms of these core points. We’ll disagree on the margins, and the method and all that kind of factor. But in terms of the issues we have to get finished, these are all issues I feel we agree on.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You’ve had disagreements with Donald Trump previously. As a part of this advise and consent function –
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Right.
MARGARET BRENNAN: The function of the Senate, will you inform him if you assume he is unsuitable?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: I’ll. And I feel my job is to do all the pieces I can to assist him obtain success, be a profitable president, which, in my opinion, means will probably be a profitable nation. We have the identical set of aims. We wish to get to the identical vacation spot. But I feel at occasions there can be variations in how we get there. And understanding the distinctive features of how the Senate operates is one thing that I’m going to have to have the ability to share and convey to the president and – and assist him perceive, I feel, what the – you understand, what the contours are, what we are able to accomplish right here within the Senate and what’s sensible.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You have a 53-seat majority over right here, which suggests you may solely lose three votes. If Democrats stay unified of their opposition to a few of Mr. Trump’s picks for his cupboard, do you anticipate all of them to make it by way of?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: What I promised is a good course of for all of them. When it involves his picks, and I might say this of any president, they deserve numerous latitude. His picks are going to come back by way of a course of the place in the event that they get reported out of the committee, come throughout the ground of the Senate, we’ll ensure that they get the – the vote. And I feel that – I think numerous them will get by way of. And – and we’ll see about all of them stays to be seen. But I feel that is why we now have the method, adhere to that course of, and provides all of those nominees a possibility to make their cay.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You’ve mentioned you must see if Democrats play ball or not. But you do not want Democrats to get these by way of. So, does that imply you already know a few of your Republican senators will not vote to substantiate Kash Patel on the FBI or Pete Hegseth on the pentagon?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: We do not have, at this level, I do not assume, readability on that. I feel these are nominees who’re new sufficient, they have been going round and conducting their conferences, which I feel, frankly, have gone very properly. But they nonetheless must make their case in entrance of – of the committee.
And, you understand, we do not know all of the details about a few of these nominees. I feel we all know loads about them. But they deserve a good course of.
We have a three-vote margin within the Senate, as you level out, however I do assume that generally at the least, most of our Republican senators are inclined to offer the president the those who he desires in these positions, given, you understand, the method that they undergo and whether or not or not they will handle the committee course of and be certain that they get to the ground for a vote.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Does that embody FBI background checks? I do know typically the rating members get them on Armed Services, for instance, however a few of your colleagues, they wish to see Pete Hegseth’s FBI background verify earlier than they vote.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Right. And I feel that is going to be decided largely by the committee chairs. I feel there can be an curiosity, clearly –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Would you encourage that?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, certain. I imply I feel that you simply wish to have as a lot background as doable and that’s obtainable to the committees as they make their selections. I’ve a excessive stage of confidence in our chairs that they may be certain that as members of the committee and of the total Senate have a possibility to contemplate these nominees, that they have the entire data obtainable to them that they need to have.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I wish to ask you what it’s good to get finished coverage clever as properly by way of offering the president with the funding to execute on a few of his massive objectives.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Right.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You’ve mentioned you are going to exit of the gate with a generational funding in border safety and immigration enforcement. You’re going to cross it on 51 celebration line votes. If you wish to govern by way of common order, why undergo this in a celebration line course?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, it is a kind of points that has turn out to be extremely divisive for the nation. And there aren’t very many individuals left within the center. Reconciliation permits us – it does not come alongside fairly often the place you may have unified management of the federal government. In numerous circumstances it does not final very lengthy. It’s a few years.
The Democrats offered a template within the final couple of years for easy methods to increase the scope of what is obtainable to get finished by way of the reconciliation course of. It’s the one course of within the Senate that allows you to enact laws with a 51-vote threshold versus 60.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right. Right.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: And so, immigration, the border –
MARGARET BRENNAN: But it is out of the gate saying, we’re not going to work with Democrats.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, I’m not saying what – they got here out of the gate. They had their first reconciliation invoice finished in 4 weeks popping out – after they bought the bulk.
MARGARET BRENNAN: $2 trillion.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, they usually spent –
MARGARET BRENNAN: With the Covid invoice. And you did not prefer it.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: $2 trillion after which – then one other – one other trillion with the IRA.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You faulted them for utilizing reconciliation. Exactly.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: It can be best if we may work out a strategy to do issues on the 60-vote threshold. And there are a selection of issues we’ll. We assume {that a} generational funding within the border is important given the place we’re after the final 4 years of a – what I feel is a really failed Biden/Harris border coverage.
MARGARET BRENNAN: There are 1.4 million individuals right here with deportation orders.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Right.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Orders of elimination in opposition to them. I’ve seen numbers that put the price of expelling them at between $80 to $100 billion yearly. Can you get that form of cash within the first hundred days?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: What we’re making an attempt to do is get an evaluation from the people who find themselves going to be in place. They’re going to be implementing numerous the president’s insurance policies in terms of the border to find out what that – that useful resource allocation goes to want – should be.
MARGARET BRENNAN: They do not know but.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, I feel that what we do know is we’d like bodily limitations, we’d like technological limitations, we’d like extra ICE brokers, we’d like extra Border Patrol brokers and – and, sure, we will want methods of deporting individuals which can be on that – on that checklist that you simply talked about. And so, it should take some assets to try this, which is why I might argue that when the president takes workplace, and he’ll do numerous issues on the border by government order, by government motion, that we will want to have the ability to present the assets to ensure that him to try this. And that is why I’ve recommended that we take that border problem on instantly and allow him to do the issues that he must do.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Is it true you are going to put some protection spending in that as properly?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, I feel one of many issues that we all the time argue about round right here is the amount of cash that we have to spend on protection. If you take a look at each Biden administration finances, there wasn’t a single one among them when it got here to army spending that got here up – saved up even with inflation. So, we now have a army readiness on this nation. You know, we now have the protection fee technique group that comes out with a report on a regular basis and tells us we’re dramatically underfunded relative to international locations like China and that we do not have the capability –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Those ought to be bipartisan points, proper? So –
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, and we do not have the capability and functionality to do what must be finished to guard the nation. There’s a giant distinction in delta within the two events and the way they strategy the difficulty of protection and, you understand, and army readiness. And I feel we’re dramatically underfunding our army at this time. I feel the president believes that, President Trump. And I feel numerous our Republican colleagues within the House and the Senate share that view.
So, can we do that by way of reconciliation? We’re clearly our choices.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I wish to make certain I ask you in regards to the different massive promise you made by way of delivering on tax reform and reconciliation.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Right.
MARGARET BRENNAN: The estimates are it may add $4 trillion over the following decade. Is that basically one thing you assume goes to cross on a party-line vote and with none income or spending cuts?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well, they’re –
MARGARET BRENNAN: You cannot be comfy.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: These are tax legal guidelines that may expire on the finish of this yr if Congress does not take motion to increase them. And it could characterize a $4 trillion tax enhance on the American individuals if we do not prolong that coverage.
We’re going to have a really strong dialog about tax reform. There’s loads driving on it economically. I feel regulatory coverage, tax coverage, power coverage are going to be actually important to the energy of our financial system, how briskly we are able to develop and increase and creator higher paying jobs on this nation.
So, I’m a giant believer in pro-growth tax coverage. I imagine you get numerous that again by way of progress in further income. Every 1 % –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Not tariffs, as Mr. Trump has promised?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: Well – properly, that is – that is a special topic. But I might say each 1 % enhance in – in GDP, in financial progress, we’re informed, generates about $3 trillion in further tax income. So, you are going to get some again by way of a progress dividend. And there can be spending cuts. There’s no query about it.
MARGARET BRENNAN: But going out of the gate with two massive points on party- line votes, aren’t you involved that may blow up your possibilities at working with Democrats on a few of these greater immigration points, or greater insurance policies?
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: We have to proceed to work on these massive coverage points. But I additionally assume that we now have some speedy considerations, issues that should be addressed. One of which is nationwide safety, given the more and more harmful world through which we stay. And, in fact, I might argue, that begins with the border. So, border, nationwide safety. I feel power coverage, power dominance, is a big goal and objective. And I might hope {that a} reconciliation invoice may additionally tackle that problem. If we do one thing on taxes, that historically has been previously. The Democrats did it twice whereas that they had the bulk within the final session of the Congress.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Trump did that in 2017, too, with taxes.
SENATOR JOHN THUNE: And that is – and either side have finished it. And that is the distinctive facet of getting unified management of the federal government. But I feel these are all essential and they’re issues that, as a rustic, if we do not get proper, I worry what the outcomes and the end result can be.
And, sure, it could be best in case you may do it bipartisan. I hope that there are some Democrats who would vote for a few of the tax insurance policies that we now have, however I’m not – I’m not anticipating that in the intervening time.
(END VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: You can see the total interview on our web site and YouTube channel.
We’ll be proper again.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: President-elect Trump has promised to seal the southern border, the place unlawful crossings are actually at a four-year low. CBS News immigrations and politics reporter Camilo Montoya-Galvez has extra from either side of the U.S./Mexico border.
(BEGIN VT)
MAN: This has been a confirmed deterrent.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ (voice over): Along the U.S./Mexico border, our drone captured a bunch of migrant, together with younger kids, making an attempt to enter the nation illegally. But they had been unable to get previous a razor wire arrange by the state of Texas.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ: Some individuals might take a look at this and say, this seems to be like a conflict zone.
MAN: The tactic behind all this optic is doing what it simply did proper now. It prevents them from coming over illegally.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ (voice over): Texas credit its aggressive efforts for the present four-year low in unlawful border crossings. The Biden administration attributes that drop to asylum restrictions, Mexico’s efforts to cease migrants, and a cellphone app generally known as CBP-1 that enables as much as 1,500 individuals per day to schedule authorized crossings.
But on thee Mexican aspect of the border, we discovered a bottleneck of individuals determined to enter the U.S., awaiting the appointments beneath the app. President-elect Trump has vowed to close down the app, increase borderer restrictions, and conduct mass deportations..
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ: Here on this meals pantry in Tatijana, Mexico, migrants from throughout Latin American can get meals, water, primary requirements, clothes, and authorized providers. But now the priority is that the incoming Trump administration may derail their plans to make it into the U.S.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ (voice over): Food pantry director Christina Coranato (ph) worries Trump’s plan to close down the app may backfire, prompting extra migrants to cross into the U.S. illegally.
WOMAN: (Speaking in overseas language).
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ: There’s numerous uncertainty.
WOMAN: (talking in overseas language).
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ: Anxiety too.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ (voice over): Haitian migrant Migueleli Nelson (ph) makes use of CBP-1 each morning hoping to get her daughter a golden ticket into the U.S.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ: Everything you are doing now could be in your daughter to have a greater future.
WOMAN: (Speaking in overseas language).
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ: Yes.
That’s all you need.
CAMILO MONTOYA-GALVEZ (voice over): Whether that future can be within the U.S. remains to be to be decided.
(END VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: That’s our Camilo Montoya-Galvez reporting.
We go now to Tom Homan. He will function Mr. Trump’s border czar. And he joins us this morning from Naples, Florida.
Good morning to you, sir.
TOM HOMAN (Incoming Trump Administration Border Czar): Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Deportations are actually at a decade excessive. They had been on the finish of 2024. Nearly 300,000 individuals deported by the Biden administration.
The incoming administration has promised the biggest deportation operation in historical past. What’s the quantity? What’s the measure of success?
TOM HOMAN: Well, let’s speak about this administration, what they declare is a big deportation quantity this yr. Actually, in case you drill into the numbers, about 80 % of these numbers are literally Border Patrol arrests that the enforcement (INAUDIBLE) operation of ICE processed and moved again throughout the border. They weren’t (INAUDIBLE) enforcement arrest.
If you take a look at the historic variety of unlawful entries the final 4 years, ICE, Immigrations and Customs Enforcement, has the bottom variety of deportations within the historical past of the company. So, they’re taking part in a numbers sport, similar to they performed a numbers sport with plenty of individuals coming throughout to frame.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: So, regardless that they declare they have the best variety of deportations, take a look at these deportations, who really made these arrests, who really eliminated these individuals, it isn’t ICE.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. It’s nonetheless a better quantity than the Trump administration. But I wish to ask you, for the earnings Trump administration, what’s – what is the measure? It just isn’t deportations on the border. You’re saying you’re going to measure success by people who find themselves already inside within the nation to deport. That’s how you are going to measure it. And what’s that determine?
TOM HOMAN: Well, once more, let’s get the numbers straight. You say they had been increased than the Trump administration. This is not about what number of bought deported as a result of Trump had unlawful border crossings at a 45-year low. So, in fact elimination goes to be decrease. The numbers, what number of had been launched into the United States that – that aren’t within the nation legally? Under the Biden administration we now have hundreds of thousands of individuals launched within the United States who’ve misplaced their hearings and we have hundreds of thousands of individuals which can be, you understand, launched within the United States regardless of a statute saying that you simply can’t be launched within the United States with out correct documentation and also you shall be detained. So, you may examine the numbers of deportations beneath Trump versus Biden, however when you think about a 45-year low in crossings, in fact the variety of deportations goes to be decrease as a result of we do not have that inhabitants to course of and deport.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. Well, I’m good to measure success going ahead.
For day one, are you able to assist us perceive what the plan is?
You know, plenty of industries on this nation rent undocumented staff as a result of they’re low-cost labor. On day one, are you going to re-start raids on work websites, on building websites?
TOM HOMAN: The – President Trump’s been clear, as I’ve been clear from day one, that the president goes to focus on public security threats and nationwide safety threats. And as you heard out of your earlier segments, we now have an enormous nationwide safety problem on this nation. The southwest border has turn out to be the most important nationwide safety vulnerability we have seen on this nation. FBI Director Wray agrees with me. We know there’s individuals on this nation pose a nationwide safety risk. They’ve arrested a report variety of individuals on the terrorist watch checklist. A 3,500 % enhance in individuals on the terrorist watch checklist being arrested on the border.
We’ve bought over 2 million recognized got-aways. We know 2 million individuals crossed the border, weren’t arrested, weren’t vetted, weren’t fingerprints.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: So, you have to ask your self, why did 2 million individuals pay extra to get away. Why did not they pay much less, flip themselves into Border Patrol, get a free airline ticket to the town of their selection –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: Get a free resort room, get three meals a day, get free medical care. Why did 2 million individuals pay extra to get away.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes. I’m not disputing that it’s a hemisphere-wide disaster. We’re speaking about how you are going to cope with it. That’s why I’m asking you, if you say “criminals,” does that imply you’re going to go into already-existing prisons, at native stage, and deport people who find themselves in these prisons? Are you going to go to workforces? I imply, how have you learnt the place the criminals are I suppose is the query? And in the event that they’re working at a piece website, are you going to indicate as much as shock them?
TOM HOMAN: Well, look, we all know the place numerous the criminals are. ICE does – they’re nice at this work. We know the place some are, however they merely have not been in a position to go arrest them due to Secretary Mayorkas’ priorities, it handcuffed ICE. So, we all know the place numerous criminals are. They’ve been prevented from arresting them. We’re going to arrest beginning day one.
As far as being in jails and prisons, we might like to work in native jails, however sanctuary cities will not enable us into these jails. It’s a lot simpler to arrest a public security risk and the protection and safety of public jail than out on the street as a result of the officer is after that approach, the alien is safer that approach, the neighborhood is safer that approach. But sanctuary cities who proceed to launch public security threats again into the neighborhood –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: To the immigrant neighborhood, that places that neighborhood at higher danger of crime.
And this is what is going on to occur. When we go to the neighborhood and discover that particular person, discover that felony alien –
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: He’s in all probability going to be with others, others who we’ll must arrest. So, it isn’t protected for the neighborhood, not protected for the officers, not protected for anyone.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: Let us arrest the dangerous man within the jail cell the place you selected to arrest any individual and put him in a jail cell as a result of clearly, he is a public security risk.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. When you simply mentioned in there, it sounds such as you had been speaking about collateral arrests. So, you are going to goal individuals you understand are criminals. But in the event that they occur to be dwelling in a home the place there are different undocumented individuals, you are going to sweep them up, too. That’s what I feel you had been simply saying there.
I ponder how you are going to parse out a few of these collateral arrests. For instance, will dreamers be protected? Donald Trump has mentioned he desires to work with Democrats to guard them and provides them standing. That takes a very long time in Congress. What do you do within the meantime? How do you make certain they don’t seem to be caught up in drag internet?
TOM HOMAN: Look, each particular person ICE arrests, they do what they name a fugitive operation spreadsheet. They know precisely who they’ll arrest, they know precisely the place they’re in all probability more likely to discover him, they usually have numerous data on that arrest. Other individuals which can be there which may be unlawful, they will deal with them by a case-by-case foundation.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: The focus – I wish to be clear on some public security threats, if we – extra brokers within the jails means much less brokers within the neighborhood. That’s why I’m pleading with sanctuary cities, allow us to into the jail to arrest the dangerous man, that approach you are not forcing into the neighborhood. So, you understand, in case you go to an immigrant neighborhood and ask them, would you moderately have ICE working in your native jails or would you need them in the neighborhood, what do you assume they’ll say? They do not – they do not need dangerous – dangerous felony aliens of their neighborhoods, both.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
TOM HOMAN: So, allow us to work with the jails. Let us work with regulation enforcement. Sanctuary cities usually are not protected for the immigrant neighborhood, they don’t seem to be protected for our officers.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK. So, that is like Secure Communities Act form of – form of motion. But then the place do you ship individuals? Because a few of these international locations, like Venezuela, do not settle for deportations proper now. Mexico’s president indicated her nation is perhaps keen to obtain non-Mexican migrants who’re deported. How does that work? Does the U.S. pay Mexico to then ship these individuals off some place else?
TOM HOMAN: Well, initially, we have President Trump coming into the Oval Office and he is confirmed, throughout his first administration, his management on unlawful immigration was a sport changer as a result of, as an illustration, El Salvador would not take again MS-13 members after I was the ICE director. It took President Trump 48 hours to get El Salvador to take again their felony aliens into their prisons. And Mexico did not wish to do the stay in Mexico program, however President Trump was in a position to get stay in Mexico established in Mexico. He was in a position to get Mexico to place army on their southern and northern border. President Trump’s a robust president.
This administration has not compelled these international locations to take them again. And we now have what we name a 3rd save (ph) international locations. We have already got international locations speaking about taking again individuals from different international locations if – if, as an illustration, Venezuela do not wish to take their individuals again, there’s others methods we are able to do it. There’s different international locations that can be keen to just accept them. We’re hoping that President Trump will work with Venezuela, like he did with Mexico and El Salvador and get these international locations to take them again. If they do not, they’re nonetheless going to be deported, they’re simply going to be deported to a special nation.
We’ve not going to be held up by eradicating public security threats on this nation. We’ve bought to place – we have to place the protection of the American individuals first.
MARGARET BRENNAN: OK.
TOM HOMAN: We’ve bought too many younger ladies murdered and raped and burn alive by members of Venezuelan gangs.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
TOM HOMAN: They should be a precedence beneath this administration. And they’ll be a precedence beginning day one. And they are going to be deported.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We will keep tuned for the main points.
Border czar Tom Homan, thanks in your time.
We’ll be again in a second.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yesterday marked the start of a sequence of public remembrances for former President Jimmy Carter, who died final Sunday on the age of 100.
Mark Strassman reviews.
(BEGIN VT)
MARK STRASSMAN (voice over): A second lengthy within the making for many who served for thus lengthy. Jimmy Carter’s Secret Service element, current and previous, escorting his casket to the presidential hearse.
WOMAN: Plains is a vacationer city, and President Carter is our favourite son. He has molded this city.
MARK STRASSMAN: This is the tip of an period right here in Plains. Jimmy Carter was their buddy, their neighbor, this small neighborhood’s identification.
MAN: He was all the pieces that America ought to have been. And he actually meant loads to the individuals round right here.
MARK STRASSMAN (voice over): Outside his boyhood farm, a bell tolled 39 occasions, saluting America’s thirty ninth president.
At the Carter Presidential Center in Atlanta, Marines carried within the casket. Jimmy Carter will lie in repose by way of Tuesday morning. Five extra days of remembrances will honor a former president and globe-trotting humanitarian.
MAN: He was held up and propped up and soothed by a tremendous girl. And the 2 of them collectively modified the world.
MARK STRASSMAN (voice over): Starting Tuesday morning, America’s remaining salute will shift to Washington, D.C., for 2 days of remembrance.
(END VT)
MARGARET BRENNAN: That was our Mark Strassman reporting.
Be certain to tune into CBS News for our protection of America’s farewell to Jimmy Carter. On Tuesday, the previous president will lie in state on the U.S. Capitol, and on Thursday, the state funeral on the National Cathedral.
We’ll be proper again.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
MARGARET BRENNAN: That’s it for us at this time. Thank you all for watching. Until subsequent week. For FACE THE NATION, I’m Margaret Brennan.
(ANNOUNCEMENTS)
